You are right; I would not want to personally disciple the entirety of even my small congregation. There are some that I am incapable of mentoring (because they disciple me), and there are some that others are more qualified to mentor (because of gender, age, spiritual gifts, or life-circumstance issues). Still, I have no problem personally overseeing the spiritual lives of a small and diverse group of people.

When I used the word “ministers” I used it in the broadest sense – not just staff, but including all of the servant-leaders of the church. I believe all church leaders (staff, elders, deacons/ministry-team-leaders, etc.) should be involved in helping people follow Christ.

If those “ministers” are mature and qualified to mentor others – great. If not, then I have a job to do. That is why I always come back to the responsibility of the leadership. If the buck doesn’t stop here, then where does it stop? Look at me, being verbose again. It is just that you hit on a topic that I speak about regularly and recreationally with my best friend.

So I’m not sure it has to be an either/or. Matt, I agree that our leaders have responsibility from God to model discipleship corporately and one on one–and probably could be doing a better job at it. But there’s simply no way they can get to everyone, and in the “priesthood of all believers” we hold so dear, we wouldn’t want them to, would we? That truly would lead to a hierarchy.

On the measurement issue, I feel connected to my friends and family if we’re talking often and about substantial things, if we spend some amount of time together in person, if we are free of conflict (either from having worked through it or not having it in the first place), that kind of thing. So if I’m talking regularly to God about the big and small stuff, spending time with him, and working through conflicts (because of my own sinfulness)–is that the metric?

What about us enjoys programmed development for spiritual formation and at the same time distains these programs?

Maybe it’s our love/hate relationship with accomplishment. Programmed based growth patterns allow an organization (and sometimes individuals) to measure accomplishments that match the missional goals of the organization. And thus, allows us to feel successful…or not.

One problem may be that we are at the same time “sickened” by the prospect that our relationship with Christ is based on accomplishment (e.g. if we know the answers to the Bible quiz). It seems to me that the best relationships are not based on accomplishment but on developing a sense of connection, belonging, community, hope, and…most of all presence.

What if we began to measure our spiritual formation by presence? Are we present with God today…this moment? What if it’s about living whole? Living with a mixture of life that embraces being alive and enchanted with what we would normally separate in dualistic ways.

What if everything we do…everything we are…forms our spirituality in a relational way with the Christ?

I hope I am mistaken when my cynical side detects a bit of disdain for the “hierarchy of leaders.” Church leadership is ordained by God. It is a practical way that God dispenses grace to the Church. Let me put my previous statement another way. If 90% of the class is flunking, then the teacher needs to rethink his/her strategy.

Relationships meander through seasons. Some of those season cannot be described as deep but they are a significant part of the journey. We mostly accept this and journey with others through all kinds of seasonal relational change.

What if it were the same with our walk with Christ? What if we measured daily instead of deeper?

I’m not proposing that deeper is bad. But I am wondering if we would take the pressure off the experience with Christ becoming more and more deep maybe we would naturally and organically walk daily and sometimes find ourselves deeper.

What if all ministers, regardless of their title or area of specialty, constantly made disciples as Jesus did? Of course this would require all ministers to possess enough spiritually maturity to disciple as Jesus did. Is this perhaps part of the problem? (Ouch.) I am a firm believer that if the team is not winning, then you change the coaching situation. If our people are not growing then perhaps we need to look at our leadership and ask some difficult questions.